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Welcome back to the Her Fertility podcast. This is part two of a, um, This is part two of a juicy conversation I had with the amazing group, GEM, all on secondary infertility. The women in this amazing group has the women of. This beautiful community sent in questions and I was in the hot seat answering them. So stay tuned to the end to see.
So listen through to the end to catch all the spicy goodness.
 Welcome to Her Fertility, the podcast revolutionizing the way women are supported on their fertility journey. I'm your host, Jess Tims. With years of supporting women as a fertility doula, I've seen the emotional pain caused by infertility, including my own struggle with unexplained infertility, and I always knew there had to be a better way to support women with their fertility, health, and healing.
We are here to reclaim control, find clarity, and transform the fertility conversation.
Okay.  How do I start like tracking my cycle. Learning about my cycle? Yep. Essentially that's the question. Yeah. So I believe all women should have access to this, so I teach it for free.
We have, um, I'm actually re-recording it right now for the Her Fertility podcast. It'll be out in like a few weeks. Um. Because there are people who sell this as like a course, like learn how to track your cycle. I'm like, we should just all know this. It's like, yeah, drives me crazy. But in a like super simplified version, I'm gonna give you the three minute track
your cycle version. Um, A woman's cycle is in four parts. So you have day one is the start of your period, and day one is the first full day of bleeding. So if you spot leading up to your period, wait until you are bleeding as day one and that is the first part. People say phase, I say part yeah. for a good reason.
So um, your period happens and when it's done, you enter the follicular phase. In the follicular phase or part, um, estrogen rises in the body and you're preparing a follicle. It's why it's called a follicular phase, which is an egg from the ovary. Mm-hmm. Then the third part is ovulation. So some people say phase ovulation only happens for 12 to 24 hours.
Yeah. So it is a really short window of time. Mm-hmm. Leading up to that point, your cervical fluid or cervical mucus, that stuff down there is going to change. So in the couple days leading up, the body wants to reproduce and it is going to make a conduit for sperm to come up through the cervix and find that egg and that conduit is cervical fluid.
Mm-hmm. But outside of this window, we call it the fertile window. That fluid doesn't support sperm. It's too acidic. The vaginal canal is too acidic for sperm to survive because the female body's really smart and it's like, get your germs outta here, right? Yeah. So yeah, it's like, get outta here. But during the fertile window, it's like, okay, come on up.
Let me give you some fluid to get up in here. So that is the first thing you can start tracking is are you noticing cervical fluid around the time of ovulation? So this, In most women this is a big assumption is around like day 14. So if you had your period, say it's like five days, like a week, the next week, you're gonna wanna start looking for cervical fluid.
Um, In the reality of life, it happens really fast. So just be aware of that. Um, Things that can support cervical fluid, if you're not seeing it or staying hydrated. It's a really high water content fluid, so it needs water um, and avoiding things that dry up mucus in the body. So. Allergy medicine, cold medicine, those will dry up your mucus in your nose and down there.
So avoid those if you are a daily claritin user you might not see it, right? Fun little tip. Fun little tip. So then after ovulation does happen, um, the egg comes down. If sperm is present, they can create a baby. If not, you either way, you enter the luteal phase and the luteal phase is when Progest progesterone rises and it basically like shuts down everything to protect that potential life.
So the cervix closes, the fluid goes away and the system is like protecting that potential of life. What also happens is the temperature in the body actually rises about a degree. So this is where basal body temperature, if you look into that BBT, basal body temperature, you can track your temperatures every day right when you wake up, it's your resting temperature and you just, you just use, the only rule is you use the same thermometer. So just use the same one and you take it every day and you will see a trend. Your temperatures will be lower before ovulation and they will be a little bit higher after ovulation.
And then, Like I know a lot of moms have the ring, does that, is that fairly accurate? That temperature? It is my, my beef with the ring. So, um, it will, It will tell you that you have a trend, but it's not telling you what your temperature is and for some reason, like I wanna know. Yeah, all the data. Give us all the data.
Yeah like I wanna know what that temperature is. I don't know why they don't do that. They just don't. But there are plenty of devices out there. You don't need one. You can do it yourself. But you can use the convenience of that. Um, and you, if you're doing it yourself, it's the same time like every day, right?
Like in the morning when you wake up kind of a thing. Because that's what I heard. Like before you even get outta bed, kind of like before you move, take a breath. Yeah. It's your resting temperature. So say you're resting is a little bit later on Saturday and Sunday, that's okay. It doesn't need to be 5:00 AM every day.
It's just when you first wake up, right? So okay. when you're resting, um, because when you start to move, then your temperature changes, right? So that's what we're trying to gather. If you miss a day, that's fine. It's a trend that we're looking for. Um, If you have alcohol, it's gonna change. If you're sick, it's gonna change, right?
Like there's variables, um, that's where make Much bigger, it's gonna change. Right, that's where the ring or the wearables, there is a bit of a challenge 'cause they can't capture all that. So unless you're really in tune. Right? Yeah. Um, And then, obviously like you're either pregnant or you're not and what's really cool, if you are taking your temperature every day, you'll be able to know if you're pregnant before a pregnancy test, because your temperature will stay high.
Gotcha. Okay. It will drop if you're not pregnant. Interesting. Okay. I love that there's your three minute version. It's perfect because yeah, that was one of the questions around the health of, yeah, we have a lot of questions that hit that like heart, body, mind holistic approach, so yeah. Um, Amazing. And okay, Actually speaking of that, how can I support my body and mind during this time that feels so defeating.
Yeah. Any tips to support feeling defeated? There's still hope. How can I, yeah. Body in my mind. I'm so glad somebody was brave enough to a ask that question. Thank you. Um, It's a really hard question to ask. It's a really hard question to like, come to terms with in yourself and if you're feeling that way and asking that question, somebody else is too
so thank you for being brave enough. Um. Yeah, this is why I do what I do, right? Like this is the heart and soul of fertility doula work. And um, what I find is like when, like, okay, lemme back up a little bit. When we can understand the mind, we have again, a little bit more agency around what's happening.
And so there's, We're really dynamic beings. I argue women are super smart, right? Like our mind can talk us into or out of anything. And like we can, We can just outsmart a lot of things. So when we can start to understand what the mind's function is and what it's doing, we can start to get agency over this feeling of defeat.
And so just kind of unpacking what we talked about a little bit more earlier, we talked about the subconscious mind. Mm-hmm. The subconscious mind is on all of the time and when you're small, um, it is recording everything as fact and this is one of my favorite facts actually, about children. So up until about age seven or eight, everything to a child is fact.
This is why you can't joke with a child and say, I'm gonna leave you in the parking lot. And they freak out because they're like, oh gosh, that's real, right? Like everything is fact. So your subconscious is recording everything and that's why when you touch the hot stove, it's like, ouch don't do that again
well, when it comes to, And then its job is to keep you safe. Mm-hmm. So then it's like, Ooh, hot stove. Don't touch that to keep you safe. Mm-hmm. Well, When you are experiencing infertility in any way, right? Whether that's secondary, unexplained, pregnancy loss, like whatever the flavor of this thing is. The subconscious mind is experiencing over and over this thing that hurts
and you're seeing a negative pregnancy test, you're not getting pregnant, and you're like, man, this hurts and your mind is like, Hey, don't do that again, and in order to keep you safe, it's going to keep you from that pain by telling you it's not possible. You should just be happy with the baby you have.
This really isn't meant for you, right? Like those thoughts are not you. That's your mind trying to keep you safe from the pain that we are experiencing every cycle right. and so when we have an awareness around what, like your origin of the thought is, you can start to kind of dismantle it in a smart way where you feel a little more agency around that thought because you can start to separate yourself from okay, this thought of this is never gonna happen,
I am crazy for thinking I want more babies. Maybe it's not meant to be. Those thoughts are over here. That's my mind trying to keep me safe and then you can start listening into your heart. Mm-hmm. And this is where I love to pull in tools of like visualization and just really allowing the heart to speak
because if it is on your heart to be adding to your family and to welcome another little soul in, that is a soul thing and so we're, we're bigger than this thought at that point. Right. So to break that all down, being able to uncouple yourself from the thought and realize that it's not you, it's just the function of your mind trying to keep you safe.
It's a beautifully designed system, but sometimes it doesn't serve us. At least it does that. And then allow allowing your heart to really feel and be open to the possibility that this can happen and then you gather more data about your body and you start to like put all your pieces together. Which again, can be really helpful with the support of someone if you have a lot of stuff going on, like a fertility doula.
But you can absolutely do a lot for yourself on your own. Yeah. Okay. I love that. And I had, I'll just jump around questions because these are perfect leeways. There was a question about, oh my gosh. Um, two of the things that you said. Cool. Um,
uh, where is it? Mm. To put things next to these questions of, um, topics. But it was also about the, the mind piece of how can I like, essentially support myself or navigate and be okay with if I don't actually get pregnant, if it, if I want it, but it ends up not happening. Hmm. It's something around that, like how can we start thinking about that?
How can she start thinking and like accepting what is happening, even though she desperately wants more like, and she's doing the things and it's just not working and maybe it's not meant to be. Yeah. How can, yeah. Yeah. So, um, A lot of the work I do one-on-one with people is when we're getting into this deeper stuff
and what I have found is this is really unique to the soul at this point. So. Um, Regardless of what you subscribe to in a belief system. Um, I do believe like there's a higher part of us somewhere, our soul, um, in the body, and truly when it comes to motherhood, like we're opening up like a portal of our soul, a part of this. And.
And I am a big believer in like soul contracts and like different things and sometimes this is often the first time where you are not the only writer of the contract, right? So usually things that we want in our lives, we just go out and get. We, especially as. Like badass women, we can just go do things in the world and, and then if it doesn't work out, we find another way or find another thing
and when it comes to creating more life, um, I like to think of it as like a triangle. So you're one point of that triangle and you are gonna do everything you can do on that, right? Like your body and your mind and all the things um, and I will support you through that. But you're part of a triangle. So you also have your partner who's one component, it takes two to make a baby, and then you have this little soul that you're trying to call in also
and sometimes these little souls have like. Uh, criteria. So like Sometimes they like, have specific things that they want or need, or maybe they're waiting for a specific time or maybe like they wanna be a boy and it was a girl embryo, right? Like whatever their c thing is. Yeah. So you're part of a triangle and that can feel really hard because there's two parts of it out of your control.
And we as women, especially, like we will do anything to solve the problem, right? Yeah. And so when you can start to see it as you are doing everything, but there's all like this other stuff at play. Um, There is a moment of like acceptance and I wanna say release. It's not necessarily release, but that happens around this where we do kind of have to let go of a little bit of that control because
we don't have all of the control. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. We don't control it all. Yeah. And so when I work one-on-one with people, we get the space to really get intimate in that and really dive into like, what is your heart saying? What is your partner's heart saying? Like, is there things that need to change?
And, um, it's a really beautiful space to work in. Um, But even just having that awareness of um, that, because I can already hear whoever asked that question. Your mind probably is also saying like, you did something wrong, um, there like, you are failing. Yeah. Like because of something you did, it's not happening,
but that's not the truth. Like You are part of this triangle. Yeah. Oh my gosh. I love that. And that there's another question. It fits into that perfectly too of the role that stress plays on fertility. Also, the role that uh, birth trauma plays on fertility and postpartum healing in general, even years later.
Like how that all plays on secondary infertility. And I feel like you just talked about that stress. We want that control, and that's almost like all this added stress. Yeah. And we're doing all the things. Like we do, We do all the things for our body and we're like, we're doing it all. Why am I not getting pregnant?
Mm-hmm. But then they're like, yeah, So can we talk about the role that like stress and birth trauma and just being in that postnatal depletion for years, like not knowing about it even, or like, you know, functionally we can function depleted pretty well. Totally. We're really good at normalizing that. Like totally.
Um, I'm so glad somebody asked this question because it kind of brings it all home. So like everything we've talked about and everything I do centers around the nervous system and the nervous system is the queen of our stress response. And so. What will you ask? Will you ask the question exactly. 'cause I don't wanna go off on a tangent 'cause I can't. Well, it was three questions, but they were all the same.
Okay. They just had a different topic. But it was how um, stress affects, and um, secondary infertility, how does birth trauma affect it? And how does, like postnatal depletion or just healing even years after birth. So those last two pieces, so like traumatic birth and postpartum healing, we're gonna bump into the bucket of stress.
We can understand that if your body's depleted, it is being str a, there's a stressor there because it, and it's not necessarily like being stressed by the depletion, it just doesn't have what it needs to function yeah. Optimal in a non depleted state, right? So, yeah. And then um, traumatic birth, this is the same for somebody who has experienced pregnancy loss like the same conversation
and what we don't uh, normalize is that these are happening in your body. Yeah. So the experience of a traumatic birth, not only does your mind remember it. And like you're telling the story around it. So like this is a mind thing, but your body and the at the cellular level also remembers it. So just because you, maybe you work with a therapist and you can talk differently about the experience and you feel that you've processed that experience, it's also needs to be processed in your body.
And, uh, We do a lot of somatic work with what I do. Because this is a bo We can't talk our way out of that memory. We have to get in the body and get that energy out. It's just an energy, you can totally do it, right? Like. You're not defined by that experience, it's just something that we have to move out.
But both of those are definitely impacting what we label as stress in the body and stress again, is just like extra energy out because the system is like over stimulated. Over whatever, over blah. So. When we talk about the system, I mean the nervous system and your nervous system is responding to real and perceived threats.
So like what's actually happening? The depletion in your body, what's actually happening? Your child, like my son this morning was like screaming and I was like, what is wrong? He's like, I'm just playing. And I'm like, Kate, don't scream when you play, like I think you're in trouble, right? So my nervous system is like, Ah! Um.
And as moms, we have that a lot. Yeah. And so your nervous system is responding and what happens is, um, in the body, your cortisol rises to respond to the threat and the cortisol is a hormone and it has relationship and function with your reproductive hormones. So then your estrogen and your progesterone get impacted
and this is a way oversimplification, but that is directly impacting your reproductive system and when we normalize or just start to live with that higher cortisol, that higher state of fight and flight, freeze and fawn, um, those system, like those other levels just over time become chronically impacted
and so it's impacting our fertility. Even if we're having a normal cycle, we could still be having like sub fertility levels because of our hormones. So, um, the, The thing though is we are moms and I can't just put my son in the closet and tell him to be quiet. So it's, It's about experiencing the life, right, and the things,
and continuing to function, but allowing your nervous system and like carving out time for it to come back down and out. Yeah. And this looks different for everyone, but it often feels pretty radical because moms don't do this. Yeah. And we're always giving to everybody else. Doing it. And yet you are dependent upon your nervous system coming down and back to its status quo so that it can reset.
And, um, this is, you know, the whole, I think the intent behind, like self care is there, but it's just not enough. Like you have to be very aggressive about bringing your nervous system down? Yeah. Um, For me, like what that looks like is I take a shower at the end of the day, but I also take a bath. I take a shower and a bath every day, and like it's an Epsom salt bath.
There is essential oils, there's low, beautiful light, and it is an uninterrupted time for me every day. To reset my nervous system and like to get to that point, it took a while. Like I had to give myself permission to do that. Like I had to get over like, I'm wasting water and like all those things. Or like, I hear the, the baby crying, so I must get out and go.
Yes. Yeah. And just coming back and giving myself that time. Like it started, like I would set a timer and I'd be like, I'm staying in this water for 10 minutes you know, um, and that's what it takes and we don't talk about that enough. No, we don't talk that it is hard. You can't just get to that, Ooh, blah, blah, blah.
So I love it like you take your shower and you get clean and then you sit in the bath. Yeah. And yeah, I can imagine that like my journey, I'm sure every mom on that journey of bringing in that like self connection and self-care, like the true, real, not just like I got my nails done, kind of a deal, but now it's a process to actually allow yourself.
Especially like for me, the biggest thing was when the baby was like crying or screaming or like, you know, now they're five and three, but they fight. Yeah. And if I'm doing my own thing and I can hear them, like sometimes I have to literally remove myself where I will not be able to hear them totally.
Like, and, And now it's easier like. And I think moms don't wanna give up control, like you say, with like, oh mom, my husband or my partner can't do it as well as I can. Right, they can't, and that's fine. Like the reality is they can't, like, I'm just like accepting that they can't, but also like what they can do is be that like, so for my son, yeah, my husband, his dad gives him something I can't give him
as his mom and Josh cannot replace me and we function as two different roles and it took me a really long time to be able to say that, right? And yet, when I finally allowed him to like step in and fumble through that role, that's when he was able to find the dad that he could be. Right. For sure. Um, One thing I want to add if we like real quick on the stress conversation, 'cause we said there's like the real threat and then the perceived threat. Right?
So this is where the whole conversation around mindset comes in and I'm not like the biggest fan of like affirmations 'cause the mind is too smart for that. But, um. If you are telling yourself the story, especially around like a traumatic birth mm-hmm. Um, the mind doesn't know that that is in the past.
It's like, wait again? Like what this is, you know, like, it's like freaking out again. So being aware of the thoughts you're having and the stories you're telling yourself can be a game changer in the nervous system. I love that. I, I, yeah. I'm a huge believer of that part of the mindset too. That like, yeah, yeah.
Your subconscious doesn't know past, doesn't know future. Yeah. And then it, I. The more you tell yourself, I am fertile. I am fertile. It's almost like counteractive. 'cause your mind's like, well, why are you telling yourself that? You don't wake up and tell yourself you have brown hair every day and clearly you have brown hair every day.
Yeah. So yeah, those affirmations can be a little, little bit tricky. Yeah. It depends on how you use them. But like, yeah. Yeah. Sometimes they do more harm than good. Yeah. That could be a whole nother conversation. Yeah. Um, okay. I wanna jump back to our cycles really quick. There was a question that said, what are some subtle cycle changes that can point to why conception is harder the second time?
Is there anywhere on our cycle that are like subtle but like red flags to you? Of like, oh, That's such a good question. Yeah. Yeah, right, Because we've normalized painful, heavy periods. If you're having a painful, heavy period that is common but not what we want to see, your period might have like a heavy day and then it should leave you alone and you should be able to function as you normally do while on your period.
If you're not, then that is a sign that something is is happening. Um, A couple signs around, so then like that's your period. Should not debilitate you. If it does, we gotta look at something um, and the cool thing is like, there's easy fixes to all of this, right? Like, anyway, That doesn't mean you need to like go and be on medication or anything.
Like, You can do some really easy fixes. Um, Once you're in your follicular phase when estrogen is happening. Estrogen's a really interesting hormone. Um, We call it the glow hormone. Like she makes you like want to conceive a baby, right? But when there's too much of it, it can look like breast tenderness or just like extra em, like tenderness in general, like extra emotions, like you're crying at the commercials.
Um, And that happens to us. But that is a si, a subtle sign that like there might be too much estrogen. Estrogen specifically is eliminated through the body in the bowel, so if you are not having regular bowel movements and your estrogen is getting stuck in there, it can be reabsorbed in the body. So that's like a little quick tip on estrogen.
We wanna be having regular bowel movements for so many reasons. One of them is to get estrogen out and regulated. In the later half of your cycle after ovulation in the luteal phase, signs that your progesterone just isn't at a level um, that you would want it to be. Um, If you're taking your temperatures and it's not staying high, that's a sign that your, uh, your progesterone isn't high enough.
Um, You might also experience like spotting before your period. Like right before your period, I wouldn't be too worried about, but if we're like the week before your period or a week and a half, then that's a sign that progesterone is, is low. I'm trying to think if there's anything else. Um. Important to note around ovulation.
There's two hormones that govern ovulation, your LH and your FSH. So you're luteinizing hormone and your follicle stimulating hormone. Both of those are created in the brain, which I just think is fascinating. Um, So there's a little gland in the center of your brain that produce, like sends the signal to produce that hormone.
So some women will have like. Pituitary Gland Diagnoses or like things going on in the mind, migraines, tension, headaches, that kind of stuff and they like separate it from their fertile health, but it could be directly connected to that. Yes. Amazing. And I'd imagine it would be directly connected too. If that's happening around like a specific, I remember before I had kids, I would get the worst migraines.
Yeah. My period started and like of course like the doctor's like just take the ibuprofen or whatever, and I'm like, but it's always right before it starts. Like there's gotta be a correlation followed by a terrible period. So Oh yeah. Your hormones were just doing the things out of balance. Yes. So out of balance that we could like talk about that a whole nother topic too.
But yeah, just like A couple more questions, but we can totally, yeah. Well actually there's a lot, but I won't go through all of them. Let's see. Let's see. Um. Oh, here. I think This one is an important question. I think a lot of people will relate to this. What are some gentle ways that I can support my fertility without putting my body into a fix it mode?
That's such a good question. I laughed out loud because I wish more people had this awareness. So when we think about the nervous system, again, the moment we go extreme, so I'm talking like fasting, extreme dieting, extreme exercise, hot and cold exposure, right? Like these extremes were made for men. They weren't made for women.
And um, Men rise and fall with the sun. Women rise and fall with the moon. So we have this full beautiful moon cycle and there is a time and a place for those things. So like, um. About your like follicular phase. Go for it. Go do the hard things you have, your body is ready to do that. Yeah. In the luteal phase and beyond, just listen to her, like listen to your body.
Um, I think that's the biggest thing is everybody is unique and you have to listen to what your body is telling you. Just because that online expert is like, do this thing and get pregnant in 30 days or whatever. It doesn't mean it's for you. Yeah. So being, and I don't know where, like It sounds to me like this person has probably done some research and is like, has something in their mind of like, if I do this, is this too extreme?
So I don't know what that, I would want more information around that. Um, But in general, when we push to an extreme, the nervous system alert goes off, and when the body doesn't feel safe, it will not conceive a baby. Right. If you're running from a lion, it is not about to be like, yeah, let's make a baby a nourish that baby for a year
like no. And so that's a super oversimplification of what's happening, but anytime the body doesn't feel safe, it is not gonna wanna conceive. So again, we wanna be able to bring it back down into its nice status. Um, It's rest and digest is what we call it. Um, It's also the parasympathetic system. But
don't, like If you're asking about something that might push you into the extreme, it's probably a no. Yeah, right. Okay. And with that, I know this person a little bit. Um, They are very keen on both like that. Yes. A little bit of the nervous system into fear will, will keep you from being infertile also
there's very real like things you can do to support your body. I think maybe this question might be more of that mind trick of, okay, I'm coloring, I'm taking the long bubble bath. I'm reminding myself I'm not getting chased by a lion. I feel my nervous system is calm. However, my brain now is saying it's calm.
That means I need to get pregnant and I just got another false test. Yeah. Um. Like, Maybe there's like a way to almost like trusting the process maybe? In, in that Like, I'm calm and it won't just happen the next month. Or like, I don't know. I think her question's leaning more more towards that. Yeah. I think this is such a beautiful question because we do live in a time where like we have a lot of information.
We know exactly what to do. Yeah. And yet we're still not getting pregnant and this is where fertility is not just an information thing, it's also not just a body thing. Yeah. And this is where emotional honesty becomes really important for women. So um, even though you feel like I'm doing all the right things, you have to get really emotionally honest with yourself on like, even though I'm doing all the things I feel
fill in the blank. Yeah. And that matters more than doing all the things. Yeah. So I'll give you a really quick example. I worked with this. I'm still working with them. They're this like amazing couple and she's like, okay, I'm going to acupuncture. And I'm like doing it because acupuncture, they're using IVF acupuncture and IVF have been proven to like increase the chances of conception, right?
And I'm like, okay, how do you feel when you're there? She's like, it's fine. And I'm like. Okay. No, but like how do you feel when you're at acupuncture? And she's like, I hate it. It's ter. I'm like, I don't like it. I just lay there anxious and I'm like, then that's not for you. Just because all the research shows that acupuncture supports fertility,
it doesn't mean that it's for you. So like having that real emotional honesty with yourself can start to give you like to color in your picture for you what is right. Yeah, no, That makes complete sense. And I think. Go ask Finley. She's upstairs. We're almost done. We're almost, I'm like, there's two minutes left.
We almost made it. Um, but That makes perfect sense is to list, like what you said a second ago, listening to you and your body. I love that. Okay. Amazing. Last question. I feel like this will sum everything up. If someone listening right now feels broken or betrayed, confused by their body, their mind, what's going on, what is like the one thing, or maybe a couple things that you want them to hear right now, it could be helpful.
There is nothing wrong with you. There's nothing wrong with you. Like I like I'm about to cry, like, because that was me, you know? And that's why I do this. There is nothing wrong with you. There is a lot outside that has influenced where you're at, but it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you and just because you're in this place, it doesn't mean it's your fault, but it is your opportunity to do something about it
and there is a lot you can do. Again, it's all about you. So whether that's about you carving out space for your nervous system, about you learning more about your cycle, about you testing your hormones, like it does take like advocacy, um, but it doesn't mean there's anything wrong with you. Mm. That's a beautiful way to sum this up.
I love that. Thank you so much. And for everyone listening, we'll have all of Jess's links to every, everything we've talked about and more. Um, somewhere around this video. Wonderful. And I would love, like if there's other fertility topics you wanna dive into, I would love to come back and Oh, we would love that.
That'd be amazing. Yeah. Thank you so much.
If this episode resonated with you and you are, if this episode resonated with you or you are experiencing secondary infertility, then please, uh. If this re,   📍 If this episode resonated with you or you are experiencing secondary infertility, then please connect with me on social media @herfertility.support and reach out to the Good Enough Matrescence Group,
GEM for short is a beautiful group of women that brings in experts like me on fertility, but in all different areas to support moms at all stages of motherhood. I was blown away by the thoughtfulness and depth of this community's questions, and I could really tell that they are such a genuine, authentic group, full of smart and amazing moms who not only wanna support each other, but live their best lives.
So if you're into that, then check out their link in the show notes.
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